Ukraine War Day #291: Will Poland Take Lvov?

Dear Readers:

There has been a lot of idle chatter about Poland slicing up Western Ukraine for its own needs. I tend to take it all with a pound of salt, assuming this is mostly trolling designed to scare the pants off the Ukrainians Nationalists!

However, it does seem that moves in that direction might actually be real, and not just hype. For example, I have this piece by reporter Vasily Stoyakin. His headline reads:

Poland’s Plan To Return Lvov Has Received Some New Confirmation

The lede paragraph: The idea of conducting a referendum in Western Ukraine has been formulated as a petition to the government. The question on the referendum would be the issue of absorbing these regions into Poland. Other details have emerged regarding this alleged plebiscite, and even of the training Polish cadres to govern Galicia. But, in this endeavor, Warsaw faces two serious obstacles: the positions of Moscow and Washington.

There is an online platform called Change.org where petitions are published. On 6 December, a petition was published appealing to Polish President Andrzej Duda to “conduct a referendum as soon as possible, regarding the reunification with historically Polish territories such as Eastern Kresy, Galicia, and Lvov. Poles, who are suffering at the hands of the barbaric Ukrainians, want this historical problem to be resolved.”

The initiator of the petition is a Polish political party called Obóz Narodowo-Radykalny (Nationalist Radical Camp), led by Jan Mosdorf. Their symbol is this green falangist thing, shown here. (Arm holding sword, but pointed strangely towards one’s own face.) Founded in 1934, this party was rather sympathetic to Hitler. Currently it stands on principles of Polish Nationalism and Catholic Clericalism. Their slogan is “Poland for Poles“.

The reporter warns that the petition itself should not be taken seriously, especially since, in the course of 2 days, it only gathered 15 signatures. However, this initiative is just one manifestation of deeper currents rustling behind the scenes. After the start of the Special Military Operation, some Poles started thinking seriously about the opportunity to regain territories that they used to own during the years 1921-39, but subsequently were forced (Thanks, Uncle Joe!) to hand over to Ukraine.

Already back last March, Sergei Lavrov warned that the act of bringing Polish peacekeepers into the Ukraine might lead to some unexpected (for the Ukrainian side) consequences. Polish public opinion (57%) supports the introduction of NATO and/or Polish troops into Western Ukraine. Towards the end of spring rumors started to circulate about referendums in Galicia and Volhynia. However, at the beginning of May the Poles were told, sternly, by their parents, that neither NATO nor the U.S. would support such initiatives. And the Poles were forced to curb their enthusiasm somewhat.

Zelensky and Duda

However, Poles are nothing if not sneaky. Measures for two-sided relations (Poland-Ukraine, without NATO involvement) have already been set into motion. Recall that on May 22 Duda met with Zelensky in Kiev; and the two men agreed that Poles should have equal rights as Ukrainians on Ukrainian soil. Up to and including the right to serve in Ukrainian governmental organs. This was maybe the “first swallow of spring”, as Russians say. Polish investigators were also granted the right to conduct criminal investigations on Ukrainian territory. There was even talk of a “Union” between the two nations; but that kind of crazy talk was quickly squelched by their American overlords.

This past October several reports emerged, of the Polish ruling party wishing “to resurrect the Rzeczpospolita“, the historical Polish Commonwealth, within its historical boundaries. And that would be quite a lot, just check out this map, to see how much land the Poles would like to gobble up:

All of the red-colored area used to be the Polish-Lithuanian Commonwealth, at it maximum extent.

On the last day this past November, none other than Sergei Naryshkin, of Russian Foreign Intelligence, announced that Warsaw is planning to annex Lvov, Ivano-Frankovsk, and the major part of the Ternopol Oblast of Ukraine. Naryshkin claims that Duda already gave the order to start preparations for this massive project.

In addition, the reporter states that his sources in Western Ukrainian Oblasts confirm that preparations for a referendum truly are taking place, so this isn’t a hoax. People estimate that the referendums (each in a different region) are scheduled for the spring of 2023.

As far as Galicia is concerned, the referendum may include extra questions such as the following:

  • Reunification with Poland
  • Relationship with EU and NATO
  • Attitude about Stepan Bandera and the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (UIA, or UPA in Russian)

Which might indicate, actually, more like an opinion poll than an actual referendum. The Bandera question might go something like, On a scale of 1 to 5, with 1 meaning “I don’t like him at all,” and 5 meaning, “I am rather besotted with him…”

Moreoever, in Poland itself, allegedly cadres are being prepared for the various government posts in the new territories. Some of these cadres are already working in place, as “advisors” to the Ukrainian government.

Possible problem: Russia cannot possibly approve of such an enterprise, and would try to stop this from happening, if it can.

This entry was posted in Friendship of Peoples, Military and War and tagged , . Bookmark the permalink.

27 Responses to Ukraine War Day #291: Will Poland Take Lvov?

  1. Liborio Guaso says:

    Once the ucronazis card is exhausted the West will seek to bring polish fan to the game. And let de democratic business continue.

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  2. michaeldroy says:

    hmmm.
    I suspect the Poles* would really like an EU takeover of Ukraine with the Poles fronting it. Poland certainly can’t afford the funding required to get Ukraine to EU entrant level, let alone to EU levels. Even if there had been no war damage, Ukraine was so far behind say EU entry level in 2021 that the task was beyond anyone except Germany.

    Which of course would be rather like Warsaw doing the Kiev role. Kiev having essentially being the local satrap for Moscow, being awarded territories to control that were either inherently loyal to Moscow or terrified of Moscow, which worked well so long as Kiev remained loyal to Moscow and then…

    *”the Poles” and there is the problem. The Poles are a very divided nation with a state/party controlled media that would make Zelensky blush. Some people still remember reading their old history books of the terrors of Bandera and co against jews and Poles. Others have only read modern versions of history which blame the Soviets for everything.

    I remember back in 2015 asking our Ukrainian cleaner in Warsaw what she thought about Poland taking a chunk of Ukraine (her chunk). She liked the idea. I suspect that while the general hatred for Russia widely reported in W Ukraine is true, the amount of hatred for their own government is massive too. Poroshenko, Zelensky, and the people that push them have a lot to be responsible for.

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    • yalensis says:

      I imagine quite a lot of Ukrainians would be receptive to the idea of being ruled by Poland. When they look across the border and see the Polish standard of living so much better than theirs. They might be naive enough to think that, once the reunification takes place, somebody waves a magic wand and Presto! they are wealthy Europeans.

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      • Tony says:

        “They might be naive enough to think that, once the reunification takes place, somebody waves a magic wand and Presto! they are wealthy Europeans.”

        I believe you are being very kind and polite when you mentioned the naivety of this lot of souls. This brainwashed generation of people who continually fall for the continued vapid lies spewed from the so- called enlightened West not only have the attention span of a housefly and inherent feeble-mindedness of propagandized people, they truly bought into the ruse i.e. West = Good, better than anything from the East anything Rus = evil-bad…sub-standard Even western shit smells better .. it seems for that lot!

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        • yalensis says:

          Sadly true. This social-engineering experiment proved that millions of people simultaneously can be turned into mental zombies in the course of a single generation.

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      • michaeldroy says:

        Of course a lot of Ukrainian Nazi beliefs were created during a period of control by Poland, which lead to amongst other things mass murders of Poles and Jews.
        It is quite strange to see the Poles so sympathetic now not to the struggling Ukrainians that also have to live with these Nazis, but with the Nazis themselves.

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    • Daniel Rich says:

      @ michaeldroy,

      Poroshenko, Zelensky, and the people that push them have a lot to be responsible for.”

      The question is: who or what will hold them responsible for anything? Am still waiting for the real killers of JFK to be held responsible [or Seth Rich for that matter].

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  3. WJ says:

    But having Poland annex a remnant of Ukraine that is poor wrecked full of Nazi sympathizers could be more a punishment than a favor.

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    • yalensis says:

      Perhaps! But most pro-Russian pundits say that Russia will not permit Poland to have even an extra millimeter of territory, not even at Ukraine’s expense.
      Why? Because it brings NATO border (and NATO nukes) even closer to Russian border.

      So, if it came to that, Russians would even join hands with Ukrainian Nationalists partisans to fight together against Poles, as happened sometimes in the chaotic wars of the past.

      On the other hand, anything is possible in this crazy world.

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  4. S Brennan says:

    “Russia cannot possibly approve of such an enterprise, and would try to stop this from happening, if it can”.

    Why..what’s not to like? I have talked several “Ukrainian” refugees that identify as Polish, paraphrasing one, “if the Russian speakers can reunite why can’t the Polish speakers”? It’s not hatred of all things Russian, they want to follow Russia’s example. Seems fair, Poland, a NATO member is doing the same thing as Russia is? Who’s tar-baby is that?

    Let Zelinisky and his Nazi entourage explain to the survivors of their self-administered euthanasia that their country, after initiating mass slaughter, is now but a shriveled sliver of itself. Let them hold torch-light parades while goose-stepping their way into the ash-heap of history and yes, the elites were, however briefly, entertained by your deaths.

    Now obviously, the DC elite can not support this as it makes a mockery of their provincial world view but Russia, I don’t follow?

    Truthfully, all of western Ukraine needs a serious re-mapping after the damage done in the aftermath of WW I by DC/London/Paris elites. DC elites, who’s champion, Woodrow Wilson, US-Racist-extraordinaire, engineered, with the help of London/Paris, World War II, through their craven cartology of eastern Europe and western Asia.

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    • yalensis says:

      I believe that Russia would begrudge this prize to Poland, given that Poland is such a rotten neighbor.
      Except perhaps in the larger context of a grand peace treaty. That dissolves NATO, among other things.
      If such a convention is ever signed, I have a lot of ideas for demands that Russia should make of the West. For example:

      Clause #1: NATO is hereby dissolved.
      […] (etc.)
      Clause #101: From this moment onward, it is not allowed for Hollywood movies or TV shows to automatically cast Russians as the bad guys.

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      • S Brennan says:

        Begrudge away but, does it not, at a NATO member’s urging, eviscerate Ukrainia and…does not that disembowelment serve Russia’s [and normal, working class US citizen’s] long term interests?

        While we agree on many things, you support Russia’s interests and I support the USA’s LONG TERM interests, which truthfully, are, as Putin has tried to point out, so many times before, are intertwined and largely inseparable…

        And yes Y,

        As a young person who supported the 1964 civil rights bill before..well..before it became a fashion accessory item, I too am sick of watching today’s lilly white “liberals” joining yesterday’s crackpot “conservatives” in turning whole groups of ordinary humans into untermensch, who then, can be slaughtered without a trace of guilt or remorse. How the clergy of all the great religions allow such dehumanization of other humans to occur without comment disturbs me greatly.

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      • moon says:

        this story is a variation on a theme that first saw the light of day in March, returning in intervals it seems.

        a grand peace treaty. That dissolves NATO, among other things.

        funny, it looks more that Russia gave NATO once again its raison d’être

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  5. S Brennan says:

    Y,

    Off topic but, still germane, 3 vids you should watch because, they feature the rarest of creatures and behaviors.

    Two mature humans in DC; having an intelligent conversation; both are conversant on the history and…the war in Ukrainia …I know what you’re thinking, that might too freaky! And hey…I hear you brother but, give it a shot.

    Dr. Michael Vlahos & Col. Douglas Macgregor: Is the war in Ukraine entering its decisive phase? Pt.1

    And then Pt. 2 & 3 which I won’t link to avoid hitting any filters

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    • yalensis says:

      Thanks for the links, S. I’ll watch them tonight after work. I have seen Col. Macgregor on some other shows, and he seems to know what he’s talking about.

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      • yalensis says:

        Okay, I finished watching Parts 1 and 2. This interview is amazing. These 2 guys are so knowledgeable about military history. I feel like I already earned my degree just by listening to them. That’s a joke of course – it would take a lifetime of study and experience to match the stuff that they can riff off the top of their heads. Bravo!

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        • S Brennan says:

          So refreshing to hear truth being spoken in DC !

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          • yalensis says:

            Yes! And despite these 2 guys being crusty old American war-horses, they know more than they think about the Russian mentality. I was very struck how they correctly (in my view) psychoanalyzed Putin’s “soft approach” towards the war, initially. Putin (along with Medvedev and others of their generation) grew up despising the crusty old Soviet leadership and considered them to be cruel. For doing horribly cruel things like invading Hungary and Czechoslovakia. They naively thought that such horrid things were only done by evil Communists, and not enlightened Westies, whom they secretly worshipped.

            This partially explains Putin’s “soft” approach at first, and his reluctance to really get down and dirty with the war. He didn’t want to go down in history as a cruel “invader” like, for example, Brezhnev. Although Brezhnev actually wasn’t that bad, in my opinion. Nor was he particularly cruel. He was just a realist.

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  6. k says:

    Polish piece keeping – they’ll grab a piece and keep it. What about the Ukrainian territorial integrity we keep hearing so much about?

    …And the EU will get a million or so neo N@zis.

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    • yalensis says:

      Hey, don’t diss Polish piece-keepers. The hyena of Europe always fights for his chunk of the carcass!
      As for territorial integrity… I don’t know if you happened to watch the final season of Zelensky’s sitcom Servant of the People. In which Ukraine gets partitioned into something like 50 chunks.

      (The comedy consists in the fact that Zel then sits down at the table with 50 diplomats and negotiates 50 different treaties. Zelensky NEGOTIATE!?!! So hilarious…)

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  7. Wradish Wrangler says:

    “Recall that on May 22 Duda met with Zelensky in Kiev; and the two men agreed that Poles should have equal rights as Ukrainians on Ukrainian soil. Up to and including the right to serve in Ukrainian governmental organs.”

    The Army is a government organ. Is this the clause that allows Poles to serve in Ukraine ‘legally’?

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